My whole life I had done my best to uphold those rigid tenets—I believed obedience would get me what I thought I wanted: a temple marriage to another Mormon...And then it really hit me: I wasn't a virgin anymore. In October 2009, Penguin Books published her book The New York Regional Mormon Singles Halloween Dance, which chronicles her experience as a young, single Mormon living in New York City. What I personally dislike is the adamant tone of “you are all wrong, let me tell you how God and I see it.” As an example, M2 commented that only a bishop can REALLY remove your guilt from sinning. Boundaries are not violated like the US Marines storming a beach leaving victims in need of hospitalization or a funeral. Sins against the public must be publicly confessed (D&C 42:88–93). Signing off this thread. Like, we are any better than them. Powells. She is the author of a new memoir, The New York Regional Mormon Singles Halloween Dance, describing her life as a single adult (a review will be coming later this week).She has written for The Onion … No matter how much compassion he personally felt, he could not issue a formal or informal apology without approval from the brethren. I eventually decided that sometimes you have to risk being misunderstand and simply allow someone to cry on your shoulder while you assure them that God loves them and that they are not alone. Like churchistrue, I appreciate this perspective. Their bishops also advised the women to keep quite so as to not hurt Porter’s career. To install click the Add extension button. Unfortunately, it will take a very long time, if ever, for superficial readings to become less common or for the “Miracle of Forgiveness” to go away even if out of print. Go home and call her right away.”. Does confession only work when the one being confessed to has priesthood authority? I felt like, as bishop, I was given a unique opportunity to help young people navigate their experiences, sometimes including their budding sexuality. If that is not the case, then we can definitely do better than just picking some random dude with the hope that he doesn’t mess up our kid too bad. But it’s not just the interviews that are flawed, it’s the institutional framework in which they occur. But this violates the consistency argument . He proposed a controversial procedure in which the doctors would have to wash their hands after working with cadavers. I, for one, am glad we don’t. It declares that these leaders are called of God, strongly implying a divine seal of approval, without so much as taking more “thought save it was to ask [the Lord]. “[You] are not your own,” Paul says. Both informed their bishops. I know now that it's a very personal journey. A second usage of confession is confession of sin. A therapist can help remove the FEELING of guilt, and in serious cases will probably be the principle agent of change, but if you have broken a law of God, a therapist cannot speak for the offended party, namely God. 5 And there came a voice unto me, saying: Enos, thy sins are forgiven thee, and thou shalt be blessed. The most compelling part of this letter, IMO, is that spontaneous confessions certainly do happen in religion, whether we do “forced” worthiness interviews or not. If you don’t like interviews, then do not interview others and do not be interviewed. ( Log Out / He was a counselor in a bishopric prior to being bishop. MOM. But I am leaning against bishops asking sexual questions at all. Sure it probably works out for some people in some places in some instances but boy is that a haphazard system just asking for consistent problems. Who has license from God? But who knows? I listened to the interview (actually twice). 6:12; Heb. I do find the argument appealing that the former bishop seems to think that the sin next to murder is NOT sexual activity but leading others away from the gospel. And when one mocks the Son of Righteousness, one steps into a realm of heat hotter and holier than the noonday sun. Malachi 2 Unless, of course, it was a bigger problem than what he originally let on, and it was really weighing on his conscience. I also have to say that we’ve experienced tactful, thoughtful and humble Bishops who must have worked many miracles with their sweetness, so I don’t have answers, other than for sure the presence of another woman and at most the touching of hands. “Do bishops have a number they can call to talk to really season former bishops?”, “5) Or we could go super crazy and create a professional role that actually – *gasp* that actually gets paid.”. Just what I would recommend if a friend asked “What do I do with my feelings of guilt over x, y or z? These questions wouldn’t be allowed to be investigated by any other person. I can’t see a difference…. Singles episode! Easy peasy lemon squeezy way to make an immediate difference even without training. Why not?) I’m sure many bishops and mission presidents have experienced this. Do you believe that the objective of the Church leadership was to give middle-aged men voyeuristic power over vulnerable young women? I have allowed my children to be interviewed ONLY ONCE and that was for their baptism. Limited seating. Interviews should be done in twos with a counselor or someone from the relief society present. People like Elna Baker’s husband get to sit back and observe without fear of indictment because they represent the ultimate “invisible” tastemaker. OCD is incredibly painful and can be intractable. “Yes, I saw some pornography on my phone one or twice. I may not be as articulate or experienced as you but I can be just as pig-headed. The protection of children and (perhaps selfishly) the protection of the name of the Catholic Church appears now to be the priority. Monkey- this is a generational difference. No. We should separate masturbation from the pornography issue. You may be an awesome realtor or hr manager or consultant or grad student or…or… The previous bishop sits down with you for about an hour, maybe two. I think the opinions of Michael 2 are more consistent with those of the majority of my relatives who are orthodox and probably the majority of my ward. So, it seems that the process ought to be modified to address some of these issues. Random, untrained middle-aged men wielding the perceived authority of god distributing sex advice to minors in a one-one closed door intimate setting is no basis for a system of healthy ecclesiastical sexual counseling. I’m not a fan of worthiness interviews. Our church is loosing credibility every time it defends an abuser, and every time it refuses to apologise for its mistakes. I question the premise of youth interviews. How could I forget. I’ve had a couple of get-to-know-you meetings with bishops that were good, and I’ve certainly had a few bishops who made a big impact on my life, but every worthiness interview has been a waste of time or worse. Also, we tend to call men who are accomplished in managerial sorts of jobs and they can bring that with them as well. Look none of those solutions are perfect but they are all a site better than 30,000 random untrained dudes doing their unsupported best. I own t. I see it in others. *I’m glad we don’t. Maybe it was my Mormon upbringing and holding myself and others to very high standards, including modesty (as in having some humility, not clothing rules). I mean even you if *you* are a nuanced sexual therapist bishop savant that leaves every youth healed and more emotionally secure after confessions of their blushing sexual encounters, can we agree this seems like a *crazy* system built on insane assumptions to propagate out to over *30,000* wards and branches across the world. Maybe women will even someday be confessing to women. So nutty I know. I refuse to consider any other options. “You ignore facets of the problem that don’t fit your narrow view.”. Thank you for posting this. Lance Homer asks “Is it just me or do others find it ridiculous that a person who wants to lecture others posts this anonymously”. A big storm had come in the day before and there were hundreds and hundreds of sand-dollars washed up and starting to die in the sun. That many people have been harmed by these type of interactions. The problem with this particular bishop’s call is that “Moss had previously supervised a vice squad in St. George and was forced to resign from the position because of ‘sexual misconduct allegations” (Salt Lake Tribune Feb 20, 2019). Do you wonder just what it was like for some of them to simply be alone in the presence of someone they thought Heavenly Father had put in authority over them let alone having to discuss their most private thoughts and actions? You could also do it yourself at any point in time. Having grown up in the church and been interviewed by many a bishop, and having sat on the other side of the desk for 5 years, I think there’s merit to the current process, even as it is. I am about 10% as concerned about women interviewing girls as the current situation.But it is not zero. LDS leaders should be specific on what sexual questions the bishop is allowed to ask. My current bishop is a dentist. Do they provide you a hotline with say some licensed sex therapist? Maybe you put some missionary couples in their RVs and send them traveling around to give training to bishops as well. Funny typo. It’s just you. I believe she was sincere. So..maybe whatever the scripture does and doesn’t mean is irrelevant because common use is set in a specific way. Kevin Lynn Baker, 56, of rural Wamego, died Saturday, June 29, 2019, at his home. 10 Have we not all one Father? However, as it seems to go against the grain perhaps you want his identity so you can harass the writer in other channels. Then there is plenty more in the Church (including the fact that women’s sexuality is often invisible, which furthers feelings of shame). Reading up on it, there are a lot of non-Catholics who use the Catholic confessional this way; however, in general fewer and fewer people confess at all, and many Catholic churches don’t even operate the confessional that often, unlike what Hollywood movies show. She was then an ex-28-year-old virgin and ex-Mormon comedienne. I recommend anyone to see an actual mental health care professional in addition to your bishop. Why? 121 writers online. My daughter is a natural leader. What is clear that you are missing her, abundantly clear, is that you missed the entire point of Elna and others discussion about the practice of untrained, lay bishops in the Mormon church having sensitive, one on one sexual discussions with young women. Easy peasy lemon squeezy way to make an immediate difference even without training. Retrieved April 15, 2019. Then you can call the best people in the stake for it and give them really, really good training letting bishops focus on other things. The church does provide some resources and some videos but I think we can say it is probably not enough and its not like we don’t have resources. The Bible says God did the creation alone ? The source code for the WIKI 2 extension is being checked by specialists of the Mozilla Foundation, Google, and Apple. I would like to defend Michael 2 in principle. ( Log Out / I agree that it can plan an important if not critical role in both spiritual and emotional growth and maturity. Girl, the ether is made of straight, cis, white dudes’ bullshit. The one thing that I found frustrating was what felt to me like a lack of being able to say that in some cases the church has done wrong. I sometimes wonder where inspiration’ lay? In response to Rah’s comments and suggestions I visited a friend recently appointed as a bishop. Kevin is survived by his wife Martie Eichem and two sons; Michael Baker (Shay), Wamego and Mathew Baker (Katie), Burlingame. I could image the opposite effect, a youth being shunned because their whacky parents wouldn’t follow the prophet/bishop/handbook in doing these interviews.. “you are all wrong, let me tell you how God and I see it.” From this perspective, a bishop’s interview is reduced to a coercive power differential. I am not saying you can’t get some relief from confessing from a bishop, but I disagree that a good therapist CANNOT. UNLESS, it is solely a tactic to protect the church from lawsuits. I do not requiring you to consider other options. I’ve secretly thought for decades that the best solution is that we should outsource our confessing to the Catholic church. Shakes your hand, says a prayer with you and wishes you luck. It isn’t an armed force when everyone decides for himself how to fight a battle, or whether to fight it at all. All I read are self-help books. 1) Sex paired confessions. It is, however, a concept heavily laden. And only they can speak to what that effect really was for them. We can’t then go and violate this advice with modifications in the current practice that still cross these boundaries. I think that’s a great option, but lacks the formality that makes the exercise feel conclusive. I am a woman and therefore not a priesthood-holder, and even though I use very mainstream exposure and response prevention techniques with my clients, my professional bona fides are sometimes inadequate to counteract the effects of years of training in worthiness interviews. She will be in contact with me. For larger things, you cheat someone out of their penance if you do that and as a result, guilt and shame can persist because deep inside you know the scale is not balanced. In fact, many would be happy with such a change because of the manifestation of continued revelation alive in the church today. However, this is not the official position of the church. I observe two main ways in which this is a problem, depending on the underlying personality of the young person. Your ticket does not guarantee a seat. If I offend God, whose opinion matters? ), I'm the same Elna I've always been. That’s a logical leap that isn’t scripturally based. I wouldn’t be surprised with all the changes the church has been making lately if there are further changes to bishop’s worthiness interviews. 1. What I think we can say is that the church actually spends very little money, relatively, on the training of bishops and don’t regularly train them on topics like abuse prevention, sexual counseling etc. If annual youth interviews with the bishop have inherent merit, why not hold them with all adults as well? I would have tried to muddle through but there is no way i was actually prepared to do things like recognize potential abuse or take intimate confession from my kids friends. Please never, never say: “Who does it hurt? I don’t hear too many people talking about cherishing long held beliefs and doctrines. The hard ones were when people confessed as a matter of form or requirement, or just to assuage some guilt, but weren’t truly repentant. Youth also shouldn’t feel coerced. Finally, the little boy asked, “Grandfather, why are you throwing them back in?” and his grandfather replied, “So that they will live.”, The little boy thought for a minute and said, “But grandfather, there are so many of them! There are SOOOOO many better ways if we were serious about this. Has anyone had a basic discussion with you on how to potentially distinguish between say a normal youth dating relationship and the signs of being in an emotionally controlling or abusive relationship? Maybe he was lusting after a spectacular conversion to bolster his baptism statistics, kinda like those sons of Mosiah who went off to the Lamanites rather than any of them taking on the governmental role they were born to.. Whadd’ya think? I can’t deny that these young women who confessed to me were vulnerable. Look I try to really take a balanced view and recognize the strengths and good things in our community. Rhetorical question. When Lavina Fielding Anderson documented 133 cases of LDS ecclesiastical abuse the church’s reaction was to excommunicate her. Dear Anonymous Former Bishop: You groomed a slice of a generation of your ward youth to be significantly more vulnerable to abuse and exploitation, while probably subjecting your own children to the same process. FULL STOP. That’s a little boundary-setting humor, but there’s a kernel of truth in it. Perhaps a different animal? One per stake or multi-stake even. Some of the worst suits are Mormon scout troops (Camp Little Lemhi in the 1990’s for one). ___________________________________________. 4) Ok how about instead of making this a bishop thing you create a stake calling whose job is to counsel and hear confessions of a sexual nature. The professional counselor helped me deal with underlying mental and emotional struggles I had instead of just telling me that I needed to repent. That makes sense, how? Welcome to elna website – Swiss Design – Sewing machines – Embroidery – Quilt – Overlock Alessandra Varga 2019-04-17T16:14:47+00:00 eXcellence 780+ Where your passion Or maybe you feel terrible about it. 4; Print; NPR’s “This American Life” had a fascinating story featuring Elna Baker, a young fat gal (she used the F … Someone haded you a handbook, a pile of For the Strength of Youth Pamplets and a wild hope that your good intentions and the Spirit will somehow magically turn you into a empathetic, emotionally savvy, boundary keeping adult skilled at appropriately probing adolescents about their sexual experiences. It begins with the most innocent of actions. A half-baked confession isn’t going to help resolve this kid’s internal conflict, or help him feel right before God, and as a bishop, that’s your goal. He tells you about the sensitive people he is currently counseling. The repentant sinner must still make confession and obtain forgiveness of the Lord. It is/could be ok if…. Sept. 27, 2019. Masturbating to porn on the weekdays and blessing the sacrament on Sunday is a kind of hypocrisy that isn’t good for the soul, and yet isn’t uncommon. There’s something about confession that’s innate to the human soul. A budding sociopath can find a very sweet place in the Church simply if willing to lie. The bishop cannot and does not forgive sin, but he may judge the matter and waive the penalty that the Church might otherwise impose against the person. Compromise, if any, is too little and too late.